CSS to style LMMS and media queries

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CSS to style LMMS and media queries

Jonathan Aquilina
Hey guys,

This is more of a question to spark an interesting discussion. in terms of window sizes text sizes etc. Seeing as web sites take advantage of media queries to be able to cater for all sorts of different screen sizes.  This would make things very easy to maintain as fixes would need to be made and adjusted at the css level only and not in the code.

Is this already being done? How are things being done currently?

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Re: CSS to style LMMS and media queries

Tres Finocchiaro
Where? Our website?  Of course.


Unless you're talking C++.  If that's the case, provide a link of what you're talking about.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hey guys,

This is more of a question to spark an interesting discussion. in terms of window sizes text sizes etc. Seeing as web sites take advantage of media queries to be able to cater for all sorts of different screen sizes.  This would make things very easy to maintain as fixes would need to be made and adjusted at the css level only and not in the code.

Is this already being done? How are things being done currently?

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Re: CSS to style LMMS and media queries

Jonathan Aquilina

I've seen mentions to css in the new theme rework being done by Rebecca and crew, by the way,  I  love the new look.

Is there a way we can take advantage of css and media queries to make managing different screen sizes and resolutions easier to deal with in terms of layout?

On 30 Apr 2016 6:38 pm, "Tres Finocchiaro" <[hidden email]> wrote:
Don't reply to me personally, and please answer the question.

Your post makes absolutely no sense in C++ unless you have a reference to illustrate.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 12:32 PM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email]> wrote:

I'm referring to it in the source code as I'm seeing mentions and references to qt in regards to styling

On 30 Apr 2016 6:22 pm, "Tres Finocchiaro" <[hidden email]> wrote:
Where? Our website?  Of course.


Unless you're talking C++.  If that's the case, provide a link of what you're talking about.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hey guys,

This is more of a question to spark an interesting discussion. in terms of window sizes text sizes etc. Seeing as web sites take advantage of media queries to be able to cater for all sorts of different screen sizes.  This would make things very easy to maintain as fixes would need to be made and adjusted at the css level only and not in the code.

Is this already being done? How are things being done currently?

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Re: CSS to style LMMS and media queries

Tres Finocchiaro
Is there a way we can take advantage of css and media queries to make managing different screen sizes and resolutions easier to deal with in terms of layout?

No unless you have a link you can share.

But our components aren't HTML `div`s.  I'm not sure what you're saying.  Media queries are uses in HTML primarily as a way to resize the page for different size screens (tablet, mobile, etc).

Unless you can link us something that assists with layout, you're not sparking interest, just confusion.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 12:41 PM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email]> wrote:

I've seen mentions to css in the new theme rework being done by Rebecca and crew, by the way,  I  love the new look.

Is there a way we can take advantage of css and media queries to make managing different screen sizes and resolutions easier to deal with in terms of layout?

On 30 Apr 2016 6:38 pm, "Tres Finocchiaro" <[hidden email]> wrote:
Don't reply to me personally, and please answer the question.

Your post makes absolutely no sense in C++ unless you have a reference to illustrate.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 12:32 PM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email]> wrote:

I'm referring to it in the source code as I'm seeing mentions and references to qt in regards to styling

On 30 Apr 2016 6:22 pm, "Tres Finocchiaro" <[hidden email]> wrote:
Where? Our website?  Of course.


Unless you're talking C++.  If that's the case, provide a link of what you're talking about.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hey guys,

This is more of a question to spark an interesting discussion. in terms of window sizes text sizes etc. Seeing as web sites take advantage of media queries to be able to cater for all sorts of different screen sizes.  This would make things very easy to maintain as fixes would need to be made and adjusted at the css level only and not in the code.

Is this already being done? How are things being done currently?

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Re: CSS to style LMMS and media queries

Tres Finocchiaro
Perhaps I didn't answer the question fully... 

Is this already being done?

No, the CSS that Qt supports doesn't seems to have the capabilities you speak of. 

How are things being done currently?

This is a very broad statement.  Layout of Windows (MDI-style-sub-windows, you know the ones the 90s thought were a good idea) are done through the QMdiArea/QMdiSubWindow C++ classes that are provided with the Qt framework.

The layout of the GUI components is quite far behind anything you're describing.  Just a standard overflow-style-layout where components overflow naturally doesn't work well with Qt out of the box.

Some items, such as the QMdiSubWindow title bars can't even be themed out of the box and require some custom C++ code to draw properly (leveraging CSS for the styling of individual items when possible of course).

Individual Widgets use QWidget, but still don't have full CSS support you speak of.  They're mostly bound to the QMdiArea or whatever container they're attached/added/contained within/to.

Although CSS allows the styling of components within LMMS, the layout of them inside their container is very (very) static currently.  We're working to make this better (e.g. with our new theme), but the end-goal would be to implement something like a single-window interface (abolish the QMdiArea) and have a dedicated framework for drawing and layout out our GUI elements.

The UI in the single-window proposal is written by @fundamental/Zyn author and his work is available here (specific to Zyn for now): https://github.com/fundamental/zyn-ui-two

This is more than just a layout engine though.  To achieve true real-time DSP, Qt's signals and slots will go away (we rely on them quite heavily now).  This also requires a good decoupling of the GUI and the core using a new message handling approach (<- closed/wontfix).

But even when all of this is done, will component layout be CSS driven?  Probably not (or only in part)  It'll more likely be driven by the underlying C++ layout engine, but you can ping @fundamental if you'd like to know more about that.








On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 1:00 PM, Tres Finocchiaro <[hidden email]> wrote:
Is there a way we can take advantage of css and media queries to make managing different screen sizes and resolutions easier to deal with in terms of layout?

No unless you have a link you can share.

But our components aren't HTML `div`s.  I'm not sure what you're saying.  Media queries are uses in HTML primarily as a way to resize the page for different size screens (tablet, mobile, etc).

Unless you can link us something that assists with layout, you're not sparking interest, just confusion.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 12:41 PM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email]> wrote:

I've seen mentions to css in the new theme rework being done by Rebecca and crew, by the way,  I  love the new look.

Is there a way we can take advantage of css and media queries to make managing different screen sizes and resolutions easier to deal with in terms of layout?

On 30 Apr 2016 6:38 pm, "Tres Finocchiaro" <[hidden email]> wrote:
Don't reply to me personally, and please answer the question.

Your post makes absolutely no sense in C++ unless you have a reference to illustrate.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 12:32 PM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email]> wrote:

I'm referring to it in the source code as I'm seeing mentions and references to qt in regards to styling

On 30 Apr 2016 6:22 pm, "Tres Finocchiaro" <[hidden email]> wrote:
Where? Our website?  Of course.


Unless you're talking C++.  If that's the case, provide a link of what you're talking about.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hey guys,

This is more of a question to spark an interesting discussion. in terms of window sizes text sizes etc. Seeing as web sites take advantage of media queries to be able to cater for all sorts of different screen sizes.  This would make things very easy to maintain as fixes would need to be made and adjusted at the css level only and not in the code.

Is this already being done? How are things being done currently?

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Re: CSS to style LMMS and media queries

Israel-28
Hi,
Doesn't QML have the abilities Jonathan is describing?
The ability to resize based on form factor is demonstrated in the Ubuntu Phone apps which use QML.  Perhaps this is what he is asking?

On 04/30/2016 12:15 PM, Tres Finocchiaro wrote:
Perhaps I didn't answer the question fully... 

Is this already being done?

No, the CSS that Qt supports doesn't seems to have the capabilities you speak of. 

How are things being done currently?

This is a very broad statement.  Layout of Windows (MDI-style-sub-windows, you know the ones the 90s thought were a good idea) are done through the QMdiArea/QMdiSubWindow C++ classes that are provided with the Qt framework.

The layout of the GUI components is quite far behind anything you're describing.  Just a standard overflow-style-layout where components overflow naturally doesn't work well with Qt out of the box.

Some items, such as the QMdiSubWindow title bars can't even be themed out of the box and require some custom C++ code to draw properly (leveraging CSS for the styling of individual items when possible of course).

Individual Widgets use QWidget, but still don't have full CSS support you speak of.  They're mostly bound to the QMdiArea or whatever container they're attached/added/contained within/to.

Although CSS allows the styling of components within LMMS, the layout of them inside their container is very (very) static currently.  We're working to make this better (e.g. with our new theme), but the end-goal would be to implement something like a single-window interface (abolish the QMdiArea) and have a dedicated framework for drawing and layout out our GUI elements.

The UI in the single-window proposal is written by @fundamental/Zyn author and his work is available here (specific to Zyn for now): https://github.com/fundamental/zyn-ui-two

This is more than just a layout engine though.  To achieve true real-time DSP, Qt's signals and slots will go away (we rely on them quite heavily now).  This also requires a good decoupling of the GUI and the core using a new message handling approach (<- closed/wontfix).

But even when all of this is done, will component layout be CSS driven?  Probably not (or only in part)  It'll more likely be driven by the underlying C++ layout engine, but you can ping @fundamental if you'd like to know more about that.








On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 1:00 PM, Tres Finocchiaro <[hidden email]> wrote:
Is there a way we can take advantage of css and media queries to make managing different screen sizes and resolutions easier to deal with in terms of layout?

No unless you have a link you can share.

But our components aren't HTML `div`s.  I'm not sure what you're saying.  Media queries are uses in HTML primarily as a way to resize the page for different size screens (tablet, mobile, etc).

Unless you can link us something that assists with layout, you're not sparking interest, just confusion.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 12:41 PM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email]> wrote:

I've seen mentions to css in the new theme rework being done by Rebecca and crew, by the way,  I  love the new look.

Is there a way we can take advantage of css and media queries to make managing different screen sizes and resolutions easier to deal with in terms of layout?

On 30 Apr 2016 6:38 pm, "Tres Finocchiaro" <[hidden email]> wrote:
Don't reply to me personally, and please answer the question.

Your post makes absolutely no sense in C++ unless you have a reference to illustrate.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 12:32 PM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email]> wrote:

I'm referring to it in the source code as I'm seeing mentions and references to qt in regards to styling

On 30 Apr 2016 6:22 pm, "Tres Finocchiaro" <[hidden email]> wrote:
Where? Our website?  Of course.


Unless you're talking C++.  If that's the case, provide a link of what you're talking about.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hey guys,

This is more of a question to spark an interesting discussion. in terms of window sizes text sizes etc. Seeing as web sites take advantage of media queries to be able to cater for all sorts of different screen sizes.  This would make things very easy to maintain as fixes would need to be made and adjusted at the css level only and not in the code.

Is this already being done? How are things being done currently?

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Re: CSS to style LMMS and media queries

Tres Finocchiaro
Israel,

I'm not sure, but here's a question to the Qt mailing list about QML with a large codebase.... 

And an accompanying YouTube video... 

And a forum conversation about leveraging QML on a desktop application:

Here's a blog talking about some layout features in Qt 5.1 (some of these appear to be availble in 4.8 already and I'm not convinced that any of them are specific to Qt Quick)

Jonathan's original request to do media queries isn't a concept the desktop would use normally.  It doesn't appear Qt Quick/QML changes this and I'm not sure it's even a useful concept.  We certainly need to eventually layout our C++ components more dynamically, but the "atomagically use CSS layout tricks" doesn't really work conceptually.  Remember, this is native code we're writing not a web page.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 1:52 PM, Israel <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi,
Doesn't QML have the abilities Jonathan is describing?
The ability to resize based on form factor is demonstrated in the Ubuntu Phone apps which use QML.  Perhaps this is what he is asking?


On 04/30/2016 12:15 PM, Tres Finocchiaro wrote:
Perhaps I didn't answer the question fully... 

Is this already being done?

No, the CSS that Qt supports doesn't seems to have the capabilities you speak of. 

How are things being done currently?

This is a very broad statement.  Layout of Windows (MDI-style-sub-windows, you know the ones the 90s thought were a good idea) are done through the QMdiArea/QMdiSubWindow C++ classes that are provided with the Qt framework.

The layout of the GUI components is quite far behind anything you're describing.  Just a standard overflow-style-layout where components overflow naturally doesn't work well with Qt out of the box.

Some items, such as the QMdiSubWindow title bars can't even be themed out of the box and require some custom C++ code to draw properly (leveraging CSS for the styling of individual items when possible of course).

Individual Widgets use QWidget, but still don't have full CSS support you speak of.  They're mostly bound to the QMdiArea or whatever container they're attached/added/contained within/to.

Although CSS allows the styling of components within LMMS, the layout of them inside their container is very (very) static currently.  We're working to make this better (e.g. with our new theme), but the end-goal would be to implement something like a single-window interface (abolish the QMdiArea) and have a dedicated framework for drawing and layout out our GUI elements.

The UI in the single-window proposal is written by @fundamental/Zyn author and his work is available here (specific to Zyn for now): https://github.com/fundamental/zyn-ui-two

This is more than just a layout engine though.  To achieve true real-time DSP, Qt's signals and slots will go away (we rely on them quite heavily now).  This also requires a good decoupling of the GUI and the core using a new message handling approach (<- closed/wontfix).

But even when all of this is done, will component layout be CSS driven?  Probably not (or only in part)  It'll more likely be driven by the underlying C++ layout engine, but you can ping @fundamental if you'd like to know more about that.








On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 1:00 PM, Tres Finocchiaro <[hidden email]> wrote:
Is there a way we can take advantage of css and media queries to make managing different screen sizes and resolutions easier to deal with in terms of layout?

No unless you have a link you can share.

But our components aren't HTML `div`s.  I'm not sure what you're saying.  Media queries are uses in HTML primarily as a way to resize the page for different size screens (tablet, mobile, etc).

Unless you can link us something that assists with layout, you're not sparking interest, just confusion.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 12:41 PM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email][hidden email]> wrote:

I've seen mentions to css in the new theme rework being done by Rebecca and crew, by the way,  I  love the new look.

Is there a way we can take advantage of css and media queries to make managing different screen sizes and resolutions easier to deal with in terms of layout?

On 30 Apr 2016 6:38 pm, "Tres Finocchiaro" <[hidden email][hidden email]> wrote:
Don't reply to me personally, and please answer the question.

Your post makes absolutely no sense in C++ unless you have a reference to illustrate.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 12:32 PM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email][hidden email]> wrote:

I'm referring to it in the source code as I'm seeing mentions and references to qt in regards to styling

On 30 Apr 2016 6:22 pm, "Tres Finocchiaro" <[hidden email][hidden email]> wrote:
Where? Our website?  Of course.


Unless you're talking C++.  If that's the case, provide a link of what you're talking about.


On Sat, Apr 30, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Jonathan Aquilina <[hidden email][hidden email]> wrote:
Hey guys,

This is more of a question to spark an interesting discussion. in terms of window sizes text sizes etc. Seeing as web sites take advantage of media queries to be able to cater for all sorts of different screen sizes.  This would make things very easy to maintain as fixes would need to be made and adjusted at the css level only and not in the code.

Is this already being done? How are things being done currently?

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Re: CSS to style LMMS and media queries

Israel-28
On 04/30/2016 07:02 PM, Tres Finocchiaro wrote:
Israel,

I'm not sure, but here's a question to the Qt mailing list about QML with a large codebase.... 

And an accompanying YouTube video... 

And a forum conversation about leveraging QML on a desktop application:

Here's a blog talking about some layout features in Qt 5.1 (some of these appear to be availble in 4.8 already and I'm not convinced that any of them are specific to Qt Quick)

Jonathan's original request to do media queries isn't a concept the desktop would use normally.  It doesn't appear Qt Quick/QML changes this and I'm not sure it's even a useful concept.  We certainly need to eventually layout our C++ components more dynamically, but the "atomagically use CSS layout tricks" doesn't really work conceptually.  Remember, this is native code we're writing not a web page.
Hey Tres
http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~music-app-dev/music-app/trunk/view/head:/app/music-app.qml#L570
This has code similar to CSS
anchors {
            bottom: parent.bottom
            fill: undefined
            left: parent.left
            right: nowPlayingSidebarLoader.left
            top: parent.top
        }

There is also sizing such as:
http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~music-app-dev/music-app/trunk/view/head:/app/music-app.qml#L285
gu is a unit of measurement similar to CSS em or percent (more similar to em)
property bool wideAspect: width >= units.gu(95) && loadedUI
But of course the UI would need to be entirely written in QML, and decoupled from the backend.
The @media queries would be irrelevant (much like they are in well written CSS using percentages a.k.a 'responsive' rather than those horrid mobile sites we are forced into)
We wouldn't need multiple UI for different screen sizes, we would only need 1 size.

Anyhow, this is not something I know enough about to implement, nor do I have any time right now to do so.  I am hoping in a few months I will have time for LMMS.  I do like it so much!  I haven't even had time to update things in a while, sorry :(   .
-- 
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